Beyond the To-Do List - Productivity for Work and Life

I’m excited to welcome back my good friend Dr. John Drury for part two of our conversation on the rule of life and how ancient practices can help us live and work with more intention. John is a New Testament scholar, professor, and thoughtful guide when it comes to integrating spiritual rhythms into ordinary life. In this continuation, we move from the big-picture ideas we introduced in part one into the practical how-to of building rhythms that create space for rest, reflection, and renewal before burnout forces the issue.
In this conversation, we cover:
Monthly Desert Days: John explains the idea of a monthly “desert day” or “9 to 4 retreat,” a set-apart block of time for radical understimulation, reflection, rest, and reconnecting with what matters most.
Why Understimulation Matters: We talk about why screens, noise, and constant input keep us from noticing our own lives—and how analog activities, silence, walking, journaling, and slower rhythms can help reset our attention.
Expect Nothing, Expect Everything: John shares why retreat practices work best when we stop demanding breakthrough moments and instead learn to receive whatever emerges without forcing productivity out of rest.
Quarterly and Annual Retreat Rhythms: We explore what longer rhythms can look like, from overnight quarterly retreats to annual time away, and how even a small amount of intentional distance can create clarity and renewal.
Vacation, Visitation, and Vocation: John offers a helpful distinction between true vacation, trips to visit family, and work-related travel—showing why naming the difference can help us be more intentional with our energy and expectations.

This conversation is full of practical wisdom for anyone who wants to move from admiring better rhythms to actually experimenting with them. What I appreciate most is that John doesn’t present this as a rigid formula, but as an invitation to start where you can, pay attention, and let the practice itself teach you what you need. If part one helped you rethink Sabbath and weekly rhythms, this episode helps you start building the next layer.
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I'm excited to revisit this conversation I had with John Drury to the show to discuss how ancient spiritual practices can reshape the way we approach productivity, rhythm, and life itself. John is a professor at Indiana Wesleyan University's School of Theology and Ministry, holding an M.Div. and Ph.D. from Princeton Theological Seminary, and a close personal friend of mine for over 25 years.
In this conversation, we cover:
Rethinking the Rule of Life: John introduces the concept of regula vitae — the rule of life — and explains why the question isn't whether you have one, but what's currently ruling yours.
The Pandemic as a Mirror: We reflect on how COVID-19 disrupted our routines and created an unexpected opportunity for radical understimulation — and what we can learn from the people who actually took it.
Life vs. Work-Life Balance: John challenges the very language of "work-life balance," arguing that life is your time — and work is just one part of it — never the other way around.
Orienting Values and Stabilizing Practices: He walks through his hands-on framework for building a rule of life, including five orienting values and five stabilizing practices across daily, weekly, monthly, quarterly, and annual rhythms.
The Sabbath as Productivity Practice: John shares how a 24-hour weekly Sabbath transformed his Fridays, redirected his procrastination, and deepened his connection with family — without a hint of legalism.

If you've ever felt like your schedule is running you instead of the other way around, this conversation will give you the framework — and the permission — to start living with more intention. Learn more about John and his work at Indiana Wesleyan University, and stay tuned for part two of this conversation coming next week.
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Make sure to grab Shortcasts from Beyond The To-Do List by Blinkist. A Shortcast is a 7-10 min version of a podcast where you get the core takeaways.

See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Welcome to the first episode of 2026! If you’re feeling that “new year, new me” pressure: goals, plans, fresh calendars, the whole thing—this one’s for you. Because when life inevitably punches your perfectly color-coded week in the throat, the issue isn’t your planning… it’s what you thought planning could control. This episode is all about Control vs. Agency—and how to stay productive when outcomes refuse to cooperate.
In this episode we cover:
• Why Control Breaks (and Agency Doesn’t): Control tries to guarantee outcomes; agency chooses your response when the day goes sideways.
• The Identity Trap of Productivity: What happens when “being on top of things” becomes self-worth—and why that makes disruptions feel like failure.
• The 4-Step Agency Process: Name what you’re trying to control, separate what’s in your hands vs. not, choose one “agency lever,” then replan from reality.
• Stabilization Over Catching Up: Why the goal isn’t to “win the week,” but to stop the panic spiral and choose the next stabilizing move.
• Plan Like a Menu (Not a Script): Scripts make you panic when life changes a line; menus give you options when the day changes the plot.
If you’ve been stuck in the loop of “I did everything right and still lost control,” this episode is your reminder that you don’t need a new system—you need a different stance. You may not control the story, but you do get to choose how you show up on the page.
• Brain.fm - Music specifically engineered to help you focus, relax or recharge.
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I’m excited to welcome Mike Vardy back to Beyond The To-Do List for one of our ongoing traditions: Productivity A-Z!
This is Part 2 of a two-part conversation — and we split it across both shows. Part 1 is over on Mike Vardy’s podcast, A Productive Conversation. You can also watch the whole two part video here.
Here on Beyond The To-Do List, we pick up the thread and cover letters N-Z.
In this part of the conversation, we cover:
What “Nuance” Actually Means for Productivity: Moving beyond rigid rules and one-size-fits-all advice into decisions that fit real life.
Pacing vs. Speed: Why sustainable progress is less about going hard and more about going smart—without the burnout tax.
Rhythm and Cadence: How to build productivity patterns that flex with your energy, your season, and your responsibilities.
Rest as Part of the System: Why recovery isn’t a bonus feature—it’s a core component of doing meaningful work consistently.
The Middle Ground Between Chaos and Control: How to keep enough structure to stay on track, without so much rigidity that the whole system snaps.

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I’m excited to revisit this conversation with Annie Duke to the show to talk about her book, How to Decide: Simple Tools for Making Better Choices. Annie is a former professional poker player turned decision strategist who blends cognitive psychology, high-stakes poker, and practical frameworks to help us make better choices in work and life—even when we don’t have all the information.
In this conversation, we cover:
Luck, Skill, and Outcomes: Annie explains why we need to stop judging our decisions solely by outcomes—and how separating luck from skill leads to better learning and better choices over time.
Thinking in Bets and Living with Uncertainty: Drawing from her poker career and academic background, Annie shows how “thinking in bets” helps us navigate uncertainty, manage risk, and make sound decisions even when the long run is a long way off.
Simple Decision Tools and Knowledge Tracking: We talk about practical decision processes—like writing down what you knew, what you believed, and what you predicted at the time—to close feedback loops faster and improve your judgment without needing 10,000 repetitions.
Escaping Bias, Sunk Costs, and Identity Traps: Annie unpacks how status quo bias, sunk cost fallacy, and “identity-protective cognition” keep us defending past choices instead of seeking truth—and how a better decision process helps us see options more objectively.
Confidence, Quitting, and Knowing When to Pivot: We explore how to calibrate confidence, tell the difference between a mountain and a molehill, and decide when perseverance serves you—and when it’s wiser (and more productive) to climb back down and choose a different path.

Annie’s insights take decision-making out of the realm of “go with your gut” and into a practical, repeatable process you can use for everything from small daily choices to major career moves. If you’ve ever looked back and thought, “If I knew then what I know now…”, this episode will give you tools to reduce those regrets and make more confident, informed decisions going forward.
Learn more about Annie and her work at AnnieDuke.com, where you’ll find her books, talks, and newsletter, along with ways to connect further. You can also find How to Decide wherever books are sold.
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