The Bible Sojourner

Was Peter really the undisputed leader of the early church—or does the New Testament point somewhere else?
In this episode of The Bible Sojourner, we walk through Will Varner’s provocative article, “Was James the First Pope?” and explore the biblical and historical evidence that James, the brother of Jesus, may have functioned as the central leader of the early church in a way many Christians have overlooked.
We look at the centrality of Jerusalem, James’s growing prominence in Acts, Galatians, and 1 Corinthians, his decisive role at the Jerusalem Council, and the way both Josephus and early church writers seem to confirm his importance. Along the way, we also consider what this means for common assumptions about Peter, Paul, Roman Catholic claims, and even Protestant blind spots.
Whether you agree or disagree, this is a fascinating discussion that challenges tradition and pushes us back to the text of Scripture.If you enjoy thoughtful conversations on the Bible, theology, and culture, be sure to subscribe and join the discussion in the comments.
Chapter Headings
00:00 Intro: Was James More Important Than Peter?
00:00:47 Why This Argument Was So Eye-Opening
00:02:06 The Main Thesis of Varner’s Article
00:04:35 James and the Centrality of Jerusalem
00:06:23 The Gospel Expands From Jerusalem to the Nations
00:09:55 Why Jerusalem Was Seen as the Center of the World
00:12:25 James’s Rise to Leadership in the Early Church
00:15:18 Paul’s Early Contact With Peter and James
00:17:02 James, Peter, and John as the “Pillars”
00:20:11 Peter Defers to James
00:21:31 The Jerusalem Council and James’s Final Judgment
00:28:18 Paul Continues to Follow James’s Lead
00:33:35 Josephus and the Historical Importance of James
00:36:29 James in Early Church Tradition
00:42:09 The Letter of James and the Order of the Canon
00:45:26 Why James’s Leadership Matters
00:50:09 Implications for Catholicism, Orthodoxy, and Protestantism
00:54:06 Final Conclusions: Was James the First Pope?
00:56:06 Outro
Article Written by Will Varner: https://cf.sbts.edu/equip/uploads/2024/05/SBJT-27.3-Was-James-the-First-Pope-Varner.pdfIf you have found the podcast helpful, consider ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠leaving a review on Itunes⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ or ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠rating it on Spotify⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠. You can also find ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠The Bible Sojourner on Youtube⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠. Consider passing any episodes you have found helpful to a friend.
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How do progressive covenantalists understand Israel and the land promise?
In this episode of Bible Sojourner, Peter Goeman reviews comments from Stephen Wellum in a recent interview with Grant Castleberry. Peter interacts with the core claims of progressive Covenantalism and talks about many of the presuppositions involved.
The big questions in this discussion are these:
• How does progressive covenantalism understand the people of Israel?
• What happens to the Old Testament land promises?
• Does Christ’s role as the true Israel mean national Israel no longer has significance?
• Does typology fulfill earlier promises in a way that sets aside their specific details?
• What role should the New Testament and Old Testament play in shaping our hermeneutic?

If you enjoy thoughtful discussions on Bible, theology, and culture, subscribe and join the conversation.

Video reviewed: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H4p3UKiZ1cc
Time Stamps
00:00 Introduction: Progressive Covenantalism, Israel, and the Land Promise
00:01:43 Setting the Stage: Grant Castleberry and Stephen Wellum
00:06:54 Wellum’s Summary of Dispensationalism
00:09:35 Peter’s Initial Response: A Fair Definition, but One Addition
00:11:50 Castleberry’s Experience with Older Dispensationalism
00:13:04 Why Those Older Views Are Not Essential to Dispensationalism
00:18:50 Why Wellum Rejects Dispensationalism
00:27:56 Are All God’s Promises Fulfilled in Christ in the Same Way?
00:33:31 Does Representation Erase Israel’s National Identity?
00:37:36 Is the Church “Spiritual Israel”? Romans 9 and Galatians 6
00:43:13 The Problem of New Testament Priority
00:45:27 Matthew 19, Acts 1, and Acts 3 on Israel’s Future
00:50:04 Wellum on the Land Promise and New Creation
00:53:49 Peter’s Response: The Presuppositions Behind That View
01:09:27 The Real Divide: Typology and Whether the Type Must Disappear

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Does the modern state of Israel have any real connection to biblical Israel? In this episode of The Bible Sojourner, Peter Goeman works through that question by interacting with an article by Dr. Mike Vlach on the relationship between modern Israel and Israel in Scripture. The discussion addresses a major issue in current theology and culture: when people claim that modern Israel has no meaningful connection to biblical Israel, does that claim actually fit with the Bible’s own storyline?This episode walks through key biblical categories for understanding Israel as an ethnic, national, and territorial people. It also explains the purpose of Israel’s election, the importance of the faithful remnant, the covenant pattern of rebellion, exile, and restoration, and why passages like Leviticus 26, Deuteronomy 28–30, Jeremiah 31, Ezekiel 20, Matthew 19, Acts 3, and Romans 11 are so important in this discussion.Peter also makes an important clarification: the establishment of the modern state of Israel in 1948 did not create Israel as a people, nor does it automatically equal the fulfillment of every prophetic promise. At the same time, the continued existence of the Jewish people and their presence in the land does matter and should not be dismissed lightly.Links mentioned in this episode include Dr. Mike Vlach’s article and books on the Bible’s storyline and Israel’s place within it.1. Vlach's Article: https://www.michaeljvlach.com/blog/modern-israel-and-israel-in-the-bible-clarifying-the-relationship
2. Vlach's Bible Storyline Book: https://www.amazon.com/Bible-Storyline-Unstoppable-Creation-Establish/dp/0979853982/
3. Vlach's Israel in God's Storyline Book: https://www.amazon.com/Israel-Bibles-Storyline-Genesis-Revelation/dp/B0GSZJGV9Z
4. Video that contains discussion on Jewish DNA issue: https://youtu.be/KofqCqKqeGw?t=3743Chapter titles00:00 — Does Modern Israel Connect to Biblical Israel?00:27 — Why This Question Matters Right Now01:41 — Mike Vlach’s Article and Why It Helps03:19 — Two Helpful Books on the Bible’s Storyline05:24 — Start with Scripture, Not Red Herrings07:39 — Israel as an Ethnic, National, and Territorial People13:06 — Why God Chose Israel in the First Place18:21 — Israel as a Transgenerational People21:26 — God’s Promise That Israel Will Endure24:13 — The Remnant Within Israel28:55 — The Covenant Pattern: Sin, Exile, Restoration40:23 — So How Does This Relate to Modern Israel?41:12 — Why 1948 Matters, and Why It Is Not Everything48:33 — Key Features of the Modern State of Israel51:10 — Is Modern Israel Connected to Biblical Israel?54:07 — The Big Challenge to “Replacement” or “Fulfillment” Claims57:25 — Final Thoughts on Israel, Prophecy, and the FutureIf you have found the podcast helpful, consider ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠leaving a review on Itunes⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ or ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠rating it on Spotify⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠. You can also find ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠The Bible Sojourner on Youtube⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠. Consider passing any episodes you have found helpful to a friend.
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In this episode, Peter Goeman answers ten foundational definitional questions to help listeners better understand conversations about eschatology. He explains what eschatology is, outlines the major millennial views, and explores the meaning of the tribulation and the rapture. He also discusses why covenant theology and dispensationalism matter so much in end-times discussions, and why hermeneutics is often the real key behind many of these debates. Finally, he addresses why Israel is such a central part of eschatological conversations. For those looking for a broad overview of end-times terminology and the theological assumptions behind it, this episode provides a helpful starting point.
Chapters
0:00 Intro — 10 Questions to Understand Eschatology
1:56 What Is Eschatology?
4:49 What Is Premillennialism?
12:17 What Is Amillennialism?
15:36 What Is Postmillennialism?
23:13 What Is the Tribulation?
27:22 What Is the Rapture?
32:34 What Is Covenant Theology?
38:48 What Is Dispensationalism?
45:09 What Is Hermeneutics and How Does It Relate to Eschatology?
54:28 Why Does Everyone Talk About Israel So Much in Eschatology?
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In this episode, Peter Goeman reviews three Catholic commentators and their critiques of dispensationalism. This breakdown comes from the following video:Catholicism and Dispensationalism, Part II: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H_cWJ9COAJ8
Video referenced on Ezekiel's Temple sacrifices: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yTD4x5-qij4
Time Stamps:
00:00 Introduction to the Catholicism and Hermeneutics
10:16 Introduction to Ken Hensley
12:55 Begin Catholic Critique of Too Much Literalism
35:41 Problems from Ezekiel 44:9
46:44 Final Thoughts on Hermeneutics and the Jesus Lens
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Visit⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ shepherds.edu⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ for more on Shepherds Theological Seminary where Dr. Goeman teaches.