Chalk & Talk

What if many of the errors students make in math are predictable consequences of the way we teach them? In this episode, Anna is joined by Kristopher Boulton, founder and CEO of Unstoppable Learning to explore how better instructional design can help prevent misconceptions and make difficult math concepts more accessible.  Kris insists that it should be possible to achieve 100% success in math for 100% of the students.

 

They discuss how carefully chosen examples, better sequencing, atomisation, and careful instructional design makes misunderstandings less likely. Kris also shares insights from his experience as a teacher and school leader and his work helping schools improve outcomes in mathematics. 

 

Chalk & Talk website:  www.chalkandtalkpodcast.com

 

This episode is available in video at www.youtube.com/@chalktalk-stokke

 

TIMESTAMPS
[00:00:04] Introduction
[00:03:16] Logically faultless communication
[00:08:39] Identifying 4 types of mathematical knowledge make teaching easier
[00:10:13] Type 1: Categorical concepts
[00:12:25] Teaching with examples and non-examples
[00:14:52] The four principles for choosing effective examples
[00:19:59] Type 2: Transformations
[00:26:49] Example of a carefully sequenced math lesson
[00:31:44] Dealing with arithmetic difficulties
[00:39:13] Type 3: Facts
[00:43:23] Type 4: Cognitive routines
[00:44:56] How atoms are different from steps
[00:52:32] Mastering each atom before tackling the full routine
[00:54:11] Quadratic and linear equations
[00:57:51] How atomization is different from scaffolding
[01:02:24] Why this teaching approach is important

EPISODE TRANSCRIPT

https://chalkandtalk-beta.ubmepsilon.com/episode/ep-82/

 

RELEVANT PREVIOUS EPISODES

Teaching Math So Students Learn with Craig Barton
https://chalkandtalkpodcast.com/episode/ep-63/

The Power of Explicit Instruction with Anita Archer
https://chalkandtalkpodcast.com/episode/ep-57/

Project Follow Through: Direct Instruction’s Overlooked Success
https://chalkandtalkpodcast.com/episode/ep-39/

Cognitive Load Theory in Math Class with David Morkunas
https://chalkandtalkpodcast.com/episode/ep-26/

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Website: http://www.chalkandtalkpodcast.com/
FB: Chalk & Talk
IG: @chalkandtalkpodcast
Tiktok: @chalkandtalkpodcast
X: @rastokke
LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/anna-stokke-3a1b4c
Bluesky: @rastokke.bsky.social

In this episode, Anna is joined by Dr. Montserrat Gomendio, former Deputy Director for Education at the OECD, to discuss the newly released PISA 2025 results.

They explore why student achievement is falling in many countries.  They discuss whether COVID, smartphones, and AI explain the declines, why some education systems are holding up better than others, and what policymakers can learn from countries that are seeing better results.  They also answer questions from listeners that were submitted during a livestream version of the episode.

Chalk & Talk website:  www.chalkandtalkpodcast.com

This episode is available in video at www.youtube.com/@chalktalk-stokke

 

TIMESTAMPS
[00:00:04] - Introduction: PISA 2025 and student achievement
[00:05:41] - Why did reading become the dominant PISA story?
[00:08:23] - Do phones, digital technology, and AI explain the decline?
[00:14:54] - Did COVID and school closures cause the decline?
[00:20:58] - What can England teach us about education policy after COVID?
[00:22:14] – Scores started declining before COVID
[00:27:35] - What do top-performing education systems have in common?[00:34:32] - What makes effective teacher training?
[00:39:59] - How can countries improve teacher quality in the short term?[00:45:24] - Why evidence-based professional development matters
[00:48:10] - What can countries learn from England’s approach to math?
[00:51:22] - What should teachers do when they disagree with their training?[00:56:10] – How to encourage teachers to change
[00:59:14] - How should schools design a knowledge-rich curriculum?
[01:03:35] - What makes an effective math curriculum?
[01:06:44] - Does PISA data hide differences between education systems?[01:10:41] - What does the OECD get wrong about interpreting PISA data?
[01:16:14] – Finland: PISA declines and bad advice about following Finland
[01:21:54] - Final thoughts

EPISODE TRANSCRIPT

https://chalkandtalkpodcast.com/episode/ep-81/

RELEVANT PREVIOUS EPISODES (linking to website)

The Story Behind Mississippi’s Education Turnaround with Rachel Cante
https://chalkandtalkpodcast.com/episode/ep-76/

The Finland myth, East Asia’s rise, and what makes education systems work with Montserrat Gomendio
https://chalkandtalkpodcast.com/episode/ep-68/

 

When a mathematician became education minister: Nuno Crato on transforming education
https://chalkandtalkpodcast.com/episode/ep-58/

 

From decline to top rankings: How England transformed education with Nick Gibb
https://chalkandtalkpodcast.com/episode/ep-49/

 

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Website: http://www.chalkandtalkpodcast.com/
FB: Chalk & Talk
IG: @chalkandtalkpodcast
Tiktok: @chalkandtalkpodcast
X: @rastokke
LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/anna-stokke-3a1b4c
Bluesky: @rastokke.bsky.social

In this episode, Anna is joined by two elementary school teachers from California who are appearing anonymously so they can speak candidly about their experiences.

Both teach at a school where math achievement has remained consistently low.

After watching many of their students struggle with the curriculum they were expected to use (Illustrative Math), they began exploring research, learning about the science of learning and evidence-informed teaching practices, and rethinking what they had been taught about how children learn math.  They changed the way they taught math and the results were remarkable. Their students began the year below the national average in math and finished well above it.

 

This inspiring conversation explores what happens when teachers refuse to accept poor outcomes and take the initiative to find better ways to help their students succeed.

Max and Todd are also interested in hearing your thoughts and questions. 

 

Submit feedback and questions about this episode here: https://chalkandtalkpodcast.com/episode/ep-80/

 

Sept. 29, 11:00 AM CST Livestream for Making Sense of PISA 2025: Live with Montserrat Gomendio):  https://www.youtube.com/live/g_VTy4q55zo?si=9CWypiuqR1GyHIWc

Chalk & Talk website:  www.chalkandtalkpodcast.com

 

TIMESTAMPS
[00:00:04] Introduction
[00:04:03] Remarkable math gains in a struggling school
[00:07:05] What they learned in teacher education about math instruction
[00:14:49] A school facing years of poor math outcomes
[00:17:54] When classroom reality didn’t match what was being taught
[00:23:43] Illustrative Math and issues with problem-based instruction
[00:33:50] A close look at an Illustrative Math lesson
[00:43:14] Recognizing the teaching approach didn’t work
[00:46:35] How they transformed their math instruction
[00:54:28] What explicit instruction looks like in the classroom
[00:58:52] Creating more opportunities for students to respond
[01:01:54] How administrators responded to the results
[01:06:11] Evidence-informed teaching has a huge impact
[01:11:38] Advice for teachers
[01:15:03] When a teacher’s work feels hopeless

EPISODE TRANSCRIPT

https://chalkandtalkpodcast.com/episode/ep-80/

 

RELEVANT PREVIOUS EPISODES

Cognitive load theory and learning math with John Sweller 
https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-s2zyd-1a717d6

 

Teaching math so students learn with Craig Barton
https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-vr69j-1a277a2

 

Using the Instructional Hierarchy to teach math with Brendan Lee
https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-3zux7-193d0fc

 

Transforming education through behaviour science with Dr. Kimberly Berens
https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-9tfz7-16f2e02

 

The Science of Math with Amanda VanDerHeyden
https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-bksbz-13c732d

 

Math & the Myth of Ability with John Mighton
https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-22c7a-139dc72

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Website: http://www.chalkandtalkpodcast.com/
FB: Chalk & Talk
IG: @chalkandtalkpodcast
Tiktok: @chalkandtalkpodcast
X: @rastokke
LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/anna-stokke-3a1b4c
Bluesky: @rastokke.bsky.social

In this episode, Anna is joined by returning guest Dr. Brian Poncy to discuss math fact fluency and whether improving students’ fluency with basic number operations leads to better overall math achievement.

Brian shares new results from the first year of a large implementation of the free Facts on Fire program in a Texas school district. They discuss what the data shows, how the program has evolved based on teacher feedback, and what educators are saying about it.

They also revisit five evidence-based reasons why fluency—being able to do math both accurately and effortlessly—matters. With a new school year underway, this episode offers practical and encouraging ideas for helping students build automaticity with math facts through clear instruction, practice, and feedback.

This episode is available in video at www.youtube.com/@chalktalk-stokke

TIMESTAMPS
[00:00:04] Introduction
[00:04:25] What’s changed with Facts on Fire?
[00:08:15] Measuring fluency in problems per minute
[00:14:47] How Facts on Fire builds fluency through practice and feedback
[00:17:29] How much practice do students need?
[00:20:11] Facts on Fire goes school-wide in Texas
[00:23:22] Teachers’ experiences implementing Facts on Fire
[00:24:56] Did Facts on Fire improve math achievement?
[00:30:10] What the MAP data reveals
[00:34:40] The impact of Facts on Fire and the results
[00:42:40] Five reasons why fluency matters
[00:43:01] Cognitive load and working memory
[00:46:15] Increasing opportunities to respond
[00:47:31] Effort, reinforcement, and building confidence
[00:49:23] Maintaining skills and promoting generalization
[00:52:14] Recapping the five reasons fluency matters
[00:54:26] The future of Facts on Fire
[00:56:19] A call to action for the new school year
[00:57:58] Final thoughts

EPISODE RESOURCES

https://www.annastokke.com/resources/ep-79-resources

EPISODE TRANSCRIPT
https://www.annastokke.com/transcripts/ep-79-transcript

 

RELEVANT PREVIOUS EPISODES

Math fact crisis: Strategies for improving numeracy with Brian Poncy
https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-u9y84-165d773

Math Fluency matters with Brian Poncy
https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-pj6z6-166741e

How to Build Automaticity with Math Facts: A Practical Guide 
https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-3ny3k-17323a9

Rocking the Times Tables with Bruno Reddy
https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-2pbdy-18f76df 

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Website: www.annastokke.com
FB: Chalk & Talk
IG: @chalkandtalkpodcast
Tiktok: @chalkandtalkpodcast
X: @rastokke
LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/anna-stokke-3a1b4c
Bluesky: @rastokke.bsky.social

In this episode, Anna is joined by returning guests Dr. Nidhi Sachdeva and Dr. Paul Kirschner, authors of the upcoming book Becoming an Expert Teacher: Deliberate Practice for Effective Teaching.

They explore what makes an expert teacher and how teaching expertise can be deliberately developed. They discuss the importance of deep subject knowledge, mental models, deliberate practice, and reflection, while explaining the difference between the science and the craft of teaching.

They also examine how teaching expertise can be measured and why striving to become an expert teacher is both a professional responsibility and an equity issue.

This episode is available in video at www.youtube.com/@chalktalk-stokke

TIMESTAMPS

[00:00:22] Introduction
[00:03:26] What makes an expert teacher?
[00:12:09] Why teacher content knowledge matters
[00:13:24] Why content knowledge isn’t enough
[00:16:00] Schemas & pattern recognition explained
[00:18:04] How expert teachers think
[00:22:55] Deliberate practice to develop teaching expertise
[00:30:31] The challenge and importance of deliberate practice
[00:38:31] The importance of reflection in teaching
[00:40:51] The science and craft of teaching
[00:47:57] A reflection on teacher education preparedness
[00:55:21] Can teaching expertise be measured
?[00:01:07] The responsibility to become an expert teacher
[01:11:40] Final thoughts

RESOURCES
Becoming an Expert Teacher: Deliberate Practice for Effective Teaching https://www.routledge.com/Becoming-an-Expert-Teacher-Deliberate-Practice-for-Effective-Teaching/SachdevaKirschner/p/book/9781041107453
Code to get 20% off: 26AFLY2

EPISODE TRANSCRIPT
https://www.annastokke.com/transcripts/ep-78-transcript

RELEVANT PREVIOUS EPISODES
We know more about teaching than ever ¬– so why is change so slow? With Joanna Barbousas
https://chalkandtalkpodcast.podbean.com/e/we-know-more-about-teaching-than-ever––so-why-is-change-so-slow-with-joanna-barbousas-ep-69/

Rebuilding teacher training through cognitive science with Jonas Linderoth https://chalkandtalkpodcast.podbean.com/e/rebuilding-teacher-training-through-cognitive-science-with-jonas-linderoth-ep-60/

How we learn: Naive, purposeful, and deliberate practice with Stephen Chew https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-mrwn2-18adce0 How advocacy is changing reading instruction with Jamie Metsala https://chalkandtalkpodcast.podbean.com/e/how-advocacy-is-changing-reading-instruction-with-jamie-metsala/

Exploring evidence for equitable education with Nidhi Sachdeva and Jim Hewitt https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-fjdnt-1685615

Using evidence in education with Pamela Snow https://chalkandtalkpodcast.podbean.com/e/using-evidence-in-education-with-pamela-snow-ep-27/

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Website: www.annastokke.com
FB: Chalk & Talk IG: @chalkandtalkpodcast
Tiktok: @chalkandtalkpodcast
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Bluesky: @rastokke.bsky.social